- 1 Introduction
- 2 Normal Moves
- 3 Command Normal Moves
- 4 Movement
- 5 Specials
- 6 Supers
- 7 Dark Force
- 8 Strategies
- 9 Combos
- 10 Matchups
- 11 Frame Data
- 12 Lilith Memos
- 13 Lilith Bugs
- 14 Notable Players
Lilith (リリス), the Lost Child of Desire. Her primary weakness is lack of mixups, since she's one of the few characters without air movement options or a ground overhead or ground-to-air dash or even a close range instant cmd throw, to make matters worse she also has poor defense options and poor anti-airs. Still, good Lilith players are no joke when they play to the character's strength and can even beat top tier characters. Her strengths include rushdown with frame advantage normals and crossups, as well as having a good cmd super in which she can chain-cancel with.
Primary objective: Dash to tick throws/fireball pressure, land LI.
[ Startup: 5 | Hit:+6 | Block:+5 (normal)] [ Startup: 4 | Hit:+7 | Block:+6 (dashing)]
Ear poke. The hitbox is somewhat high which makes it whiff most crouching characters. Advantageous on hit/block and gains a renda bonus. Primarily used for dash cancelling or guard breaking rather than as an actual threat. Can also be used to hit people out of poorly spaced hops or instant air dashes especially during overaggressive blockstrings and resets in pressure.
[ Startup: 5 | Hit:+6 | Block:+5 | Renda: H:+9 B:+8 (normal) ] [ Startup: 4 | Hit:+7 | Block:+6 (dashing)]
Light Chop. Despite it's appearance it's basically identical in frame and function to the far version.
[ Startup: 8 | Hit:+4 | Block:+3 (normal) ] [ Startup: 7 | Hit:+5 | Block:+4 (dashing)]
Side Chop. Good long hitbox, cancelable, and excellent frame advantage on hit/block make this rather ideal for dash pressure and general midrange poking. Your basic go-to move when at a distance. It is important to learn which characters can crouch under this move. Has a hitbox located higher than MK so it is often used to catch people jumping out of pressure and also used to guard break after a blocked airchain.
[ Startup: 6 | Hit:-5 | Block:-6 (normal) ] [ Startup: 5 | Hit:-4 | Block:-5 (dashing)]
Drill. Nearly worthless, try to avoid using this. The hitbox is deceptively high and small so it will whiff crouching characters and it does not make for an anti-air either. The frame disadvantage on this move is terrible as well. It's one saving grace is that it's canceable, but during a dash it's neither cancelable or chainable so you most definitely want to avoid using it during a dash unless you fully intend to LI cancel it.
[ Startup: 9 | Hit:-1 | Block:-2 (normal) ] [ Startup: 8 | Hit:-0 | Block:-1 (dashing)]
Needles. Pretty good hitbox, but not very good frame advantage. This is sometimes used due to the long active duration, which allows one to buffer LI easily during it, and also to slide a great distance during a dash. One could use it as a meaty due to it's long active hitframes, but in general it's only very sparsely used. Although n.HP is preferred, the dashing version is a good way to guardbreak after a blocked fireball or a blocked j.HK due it large horizontal hitbox.
[ Startup: 9 | Hit:+3 | Block:+2 (normal) ] [ Startup: 8 | Hit:+4 | Block:+3 (dashing)]
Upper Spikes. This is the preferred move to use when attempting to input a throw, since accidentally getting this is way better than accidentally getting n.MP. Although it's not special cancelable it has decent frame advantage and a rather bizarre/interesting hitbox. This move seems to move Lilith forward a deceptive amount making quite a lot of counter-pokes whiff through her body entirely. It also has very good vertical reach so it's a pretty good option select between throw/anti-jump-out.
[ Startup: 6 | Hit:+5 | Block:+4 | Renda: H:+8 B:+7 (normal) ] [ Startup: 5 | Hit:+6 | Block:+5 (dashing)]
Shin kick. Has a lower hitbox than LP which makes it more commonly used as a dash attack than LP. The far version of this move has roughly the same advantage and renda bonus as LP, however it looks identical in appearance to the close version which does not have the same advantage, making the move somewhat problematic. In general, a pretty good light attack, best if spaced to max range or chained/linked into itself.
[ Startup: 6 | Hit:+3 | Block:+2 | Renda: H:+6 B:+5 (normal) ] [ Startup: 5 | Hit:+4 | Block:+3 (dashing)]
Identical in appearance to LK, except that the frame advantage on the close version is only about half as good as the far version or LP. Be that as it may, it basically has the same uses.
[ Startup: 6 | Hit:+2 | Block:+1 (normal) ] [ Startup: 5 | Hit:+3 | Block:+2 (dashing) ]
Boot. Good hitbox. However it is not cancelable and the frame advantage off it is not quite as good as far MP, but it's still advantageous. The dash version makes a pretty good tick throw setup when alternated with staggers. Due to the total worthlessness of close MP it's sometimes a good idea to use MK in order to avoid running the risk of getting close MP by accident.
[ Startup: 20 | Hit:-5 | Block:-6 (normal) ] [ Startup: 19 | Hit:-4 | Block:-5 (dashing)]
Scythe. Despite it's very slow startup and appearance this move is not an overhead. Which basically makes it pretty worthless. You can sometimes use it as an anti-air, or to set up a frame trap LI-cancel gimmick, but in general you won't be using this move much (if at all).
[ Startup: 8 | Hit:-5 | Block:-6 (normal) ] [ Startup: 7 | Hit:-4 | Block:-5 (dashing)]
Spinner. Because this move is multi-hit, it makes for a good hit-confirm into LI, since you have plenty of time to both buffer the input and confirm the hit. Unfortunately, like the far version, it's both uncancellable and disadvantageous on hit/block, so ideally you would cancel to LI regardless if it hits or not.
[ Startup: 4 | Hit:+8 | Block:+7 | Renda: H:+11 B:+10 ]
Jab. High blockable. Despite being high blockable this is one of Lilith's essential moves due to it having the highest frame advantage and renda bonus out of her moveset. It's also one of the ways she can confirm into LI, as chaining or linking crouching jabs into themselves begins the LI input. Generally a good way to reset/start dash pressure due to it having extremely good frame advantage.
[ Startup: 6 | Hit:+2 | Block:+1 ]
Wing Blades. Kind of a relatively crappy move. Her c.MK has better range, faster startup, and much better advantage. Fortunately it's not disadvantageous and it's cancelable, but for the most part she has other moves that do everything it does but better.
[ Startup: 9 | Hit:-2 | Block: -3 ]
Wing Whip. One of Lilith's essential moves for comboing LI. Typically chained into and then cmd-super canceled into LI. It's unfortunately not frame advantageous and not cancelable, but it's also not particularly punishable. It's only mildly useful as a poke though, typically players only use it during chains.
[ Startup: 4 | Hit:+6 | Block:+5 | Renda: H:+9 B:+8 ]
Low Short. Hits low, cancelable, good frame advantage. A typical low short. Not as advantageous as c.LP, but still pretty good and also gains a renda bonus.
[ Startup: 4 | Hit:-2 | Block:-3 ]
Low Forward. Hits low, cancelable, decent frame advantage. It's a nice poke, and is useful during dash rushdown for cancelling into Soul Flash pressure or simply to combo into Soul Flash or Merry Turn. The best part about this move though is the disturbingly fast startup, as it shares the same startup speed as c.LP and c.LK at four frames. Definitely the move of choice for special cancels.
[ Startup: 14 | Hit: Knockdown | Block:-20 ]
Scythe Slide. Hits low, sweeps. This move is pretty horrible. Only use it when you're able to hitconfirm it off a normal chain. About the only other time you'd want to use this is if you were going to try a gimmicky blocked c.HK into LI frametrap.
[ Startup: 5 ]
Needle. Typical jumping jab. Her fastest startup for a jumping attack. Sometimes used together with j.LK to confirm into LI.
[ Startup: 6 ]
Blades. Decent j.MP. The hitbox extends downwards somewhat which is good for startup a jumpin airchain, such as j.MP j.MK.
[ Startup: 7 ]
Spinning Rims. Deceptive hitbox. The sprite looks like it hits all around her, but it does not. Usable as a crossup against wide characters, though not as much crossup potential as j.MK. A general purpose air-to-air or air-to-ground move. Possibly her best jumping attack, though j.LP and j.MK are her go-to moves in the air.
[ Startup: 6 ]
Knee. Typical jumping short. Useful in air battles or after chicken blocking. Also useful to stuff some anti-airs.
[ Startup: 6 ]
Leg Thrust. Has crossup potential. May be better as a crossup than j.HP in some regards. Also useful in air-to-air battles since it extends quite a ways forwards. Pretty good after airblocking as well since the startup is quite fast and the reach is good.
[ Startup: 9 ]
Scythe Swing. Great range. Typically used at max range when everything else would miss. This is pretty good for beating anti-airs when spaced properly since the hitbox is so good at max range. Not very good in air-to-air battles though since the startup is slow. Vertical jumping HK makes a pretty good poke or zoning tool simply because of the range and hitbox. Still, it's not something that is used frequently, but rather just when the situation calls for it.
Command Normal Moves
P Throw: Hug Cut. Pretty decent normal throw as Lilith recovers very quickly, giving it pretty good okizeme options. If the opponent techs they will be reset just outside of sweep range, and Lilith still recovers before the opponent, making it pretty good for okizeme even if tech'd. Ideally you'd want to throw towards the corner, and avoid using MP in order to avoid the risk of getting n.MP.
Air Throw: Slam. Pretty good air throw. The range is good and it grabs people in front or very slightly above her. She recovers quickly from this airthrow so even if the opponent tech hits she recovers a few frames sooner than them. It's controllable and she throws opposite of the direction held, so throwing away from the corner results in the opponent being tossed towards the corner. Not a bad anti-air option select when used in combination with chicken blocking.
Pursuit: Stomp. Typical pursuit in terms of speed and damage, however Lilith's pursuit is one of the few that causes the character to bounce to the other side of the opponent after using it. Thus, you don't want to use it against a cornered opponent, but if your back is to the corner it's fairly useful for getting out quickly. Because Lilith relies on okizeme so much it's generally a bad idea to use this move unless it will KO the opponent, or if you are intentionally whiffing it in order to close the distance between you and the opponent.
Walk: Average Fast-type walk speed and height.
Dash: A ground-based dash. Good movement speed, cancelable fairly early into a quickstop by pressing 4 out of a forward dash or 6 out of a back dash. Attacking during a dash will result in a while-dashing attack. Generally speaking Lilith's while-dashing attacks gain a small frame advantage over her normal attacks but lose their ability to chain or cancel. The dashing attacks also maintain some dash momentum and Lilith will continue to slide for a bit.
Jump: Average jump height and arc. Average startup speed and movement speed. Added cancellable landing recovery pose.
Super Jump: A much higher jump than her standard jump, and also more startup. Lilith will automatically turn around if she crosses over the opponent, allowing her to attack towards the opponent. Aside from the auto turn and jump arc it is identical in all other regards. This move is accompanied by a voice sample and a trail of graphical sparklies. Fairly useful movement option though not something to be spammed recklessly.
| Soul Flash (fireball) – 236P (air):
| Shining Blade (DP) – 623P (GC):
| Merry Turn (tatsu) – 214K:
| Mystic Arrow (throw) - 624P:
| Super Jump (sj) - 2 7/8/9:
| Splendor Love (bats) - 623KK:
This has no invulnerability frames despite the motion and appearance. As far as supers go this one's not very useful. The long recovery and poor startup make it basically worthless outside of combos, especially due to the complete lack of invincibility. The only reason to use it outside of a combo is just to see Lilith naked. However, the damage is pretty decent inside combos (a tiny bit more damage than LI) and it's hit confirmable off a link into c.MK. Still, most Lilith players rather attempt a LI instead of S.Love so it's very rarely used.
| Luminous Illusion (raging demon) - LP, LP, 6, LK, HP (air):
Lilith's most useful super, assuming you can execute it well. Because it's a cmd super it's comboability is high. The damage is also good and it's recovery on whiff is basically non-existent (actually 1F). Even though there is some punishable recovery on block it's not especially easy to punish it. Generally speaking this is the move you want to practice doing, because it's one of Lilith's strongest assets as a use any-time any-where kind of move. The 4F startup on this move makes it an excellent point-blank punish as well.
For some reason, after Dark-Force has ended, Luminous Illusion does significantly less damage. Her two Dark-Force both affect the damage in different ways. Never activate Dark-Force.
| Gloomy Puppet Show (dance) - 426KK:
One of the few supers in the game that costs two stocks. Damage is dependent on how well the Lilith player inputs the attack inputs shown during the dance. Pretty worthless as a super, especially due to how much it costs and it's ridiculously slow startup. If the damage was actually worth it it might be something to use occasionally, but since it's not worth it this move hardly gets any use. One esoteric gimmick is to first use Lilith's Mimic Doll Dark Force then do the Puppet Show, since the doll will mimic the hat toss it can catch people unaware.
Illusion Attack: Mindless Doll - Same strength P + K:
- Both of Lilith's Dark Forces are fairly useful, though the recovery duration kind of hurts it. If you find yourself building up more meter than you can use, it may be a good idea to use a DF. Though ideally you'd want to knock the opponent down or superjump away from them before deactivation to avoid punishment, or use a LP/ES Soul Flash right before deactivation to help provide some cover fire.
- Mimic Doll (Light/Medium Version): A copy image follows behind Lilith and mimics everything she does with a short delay. The doll can't be hit, but it will perform every action Lilith does exactly as she does it, which includes throwing actual fireballs and even her Puppet Show projectile. Unfortunately it's not possible to set up unblockables with this move because the doll doesn't retain overhead properties on jumping attacks. It is, however, possible to launch some pretty beefy pressure and perform custom-combo-esque juggles.
- Mirror Doll (Heavy Version): A copy image teleports behind the opponent and mirrors everything Lilith does with no delay. The doll will keep relative distance from the opponent as Lilith's real body, and will face towards the opponent, essentially making the opponent act as a mirror. Like the Mimic Doll the doll can't be hit but it will copy every action Lilith does exactly as she does it.
- Lilith's main damage comes from tick throwing and staggers into LI. However, she also has pretty good crossups which she can attempt to use after landing a frame advantage normal or jumpin (then rejump). Her crossups being her one and only source of reliable high/low and left/right mixups.
- Lilith lacks a solid anti-air and her pokes aren't quite as good as many of the other cast members, thus it's important to zone and poke with 236P, and preferably j.2369P in order to discourage jump-ins.
- For defense Lilith doesn't really have much to rely on other than her sub-par 623P, so maintaining initiative is crucial.
- Due to the speed at which LI starts up and it's safety on whiff it's a pretty good idea to use it whenever you can, off anything. If it whiffs it's almost like a command dash, and if it hits you get damage since it combos off anything. You can even buffer it off dashing attacks and air attacks.
- Even though 236P's frame advantage is poor at point blank, it's quite good when used at a distance and can add a lot to her pressure game. Staggering normals into cancelable links then cancelling into 236P is going to provide you with advantageous situations, since it would be dangerous for the opponent to attempt a jump out and they won't be able to poke through the fireball, allowing Lilith to move in for free.
- It's recommended to stay on the ground as much as possible, but again due to her poor anti-air game you'll find yourself using vertical jumps, chicken block / air throw option selects, and sometimes even backdashes in addition to TK Soul Flashes in order to not get air dominated.
- A generic/common approach with Lilith would be to j.2369LP for cover, then chase it with d.MP/d.MK followed by c.LP, +c.MK xx 236P. Vary with c.LP/c.LK staggers and close d.MK into throw.
- Lilith does have a few gimmicks at her disposal, such as super jumping over the opponent and attacking once she will turn towards them. She can also use her particularly laggy d.HK or c.HK to set up an LI frametrap by intentionally confirming a block and then cancelling before the opponent retaliates. But for the most part it's not a good use of meter.
- As a gamble, Lilith can also use one of her Dark Force modes in order to bolster her midrange pressure or enhance her combo damage. Though these come at the risk of punishable deactivation which could lead to massive punishment. Generally you'll only want to take this risk if you feel you absolutely need the activation invulnerability to escape a mixup/trap or if you're very confident you can cover your deactivation window.
- Use throws to enable your frame frame-traps
- c.LK c.MP c.MK c.HP > LI
- Bread and butter chain into optional LI
- c.LP c.LP +c.MK xx 214K/236P/623KK
- A link into c.MK taking advantage of the renda bonus from chained c.LPs. Good for hit/block confirming. On block the 236P is preferred, and on hit you can combo into either 214K or 623KK for a knockdown plus damage. Alternately you can replace the c.MK with a dashing attack for added pressure.
- c.LK c.MK c.HK
- Useful chain for a simple knockdown. Not really that great for oki but not exactly terrible either.
- d.MP, +c.LP, +c.MK, 236P
- Typical airtight blockstring. On hit you can switch 236P with 214K or 623KK for a valid combo as well.
- d.LP/d.MP/d.LK, +c.LP/+c.LK/+c.MK > etc
- To elaborate on the above: the far range dashing LP, MP, or LK will link into c.LP or c.LK or c.MK on hit for a valid link and is also airtight on block if timed properly. However, only the far versions of these moves will reward with enough frame advantage to make it valid/airtight, not the near versions.
- 624PP, 214HK / walking-LI or dashing-LI
- Technically it's possible to get an LI off a max range from corner 624PP but it requires you to either walk, dash, or jump. However, 214HK is an easy followup. You can also do a dashing normal or jumping HK and it will not reset the opponent, but rather it will cause a down instead.
- c.LP c.LP, +d.LP, +c.LP, MP LI
- Only works on standing characters and requires some insanely good link timing. Alternately you can switch the MP with a +c.MK 214HK ender.
- c.LP, +c.MK, 623KK
- Only works point blank, or against wide characters, or in the corner.
- Dark Force 1, c.MK, 623LP, [236LP]xN
- Corner only. End with LI.
- Dark Force 3, [c.LP]xN
- Possible midscreen. End with n.HK into LI if close enough.
- lp, RENDA st.lp LINK d.lp
- land during the active frames of j.mk or j.hp or j.hk then LINK a dash attack
Q-Bee: 3-7 Q-Bee's favor. By far and away Lilith's worst matchup. Q-Bee not only crouches under Lilith's fireball but also Lillith's MP. To make matters worse Q-Bee is free to poke with her low attacks right under them, totally ignoring them. That right there takes away a huge chunk of Lilith's offensive game. And on the defensive front, although fireballs can sometimes discourage an IAD spamming Q-Bee, it isn't difficult at all for the Q-Bee player to use float block option selects to get over the fireball. And if you place the fireball too high it's much too easy for the Q-Bee player to walk right up to it and poke under it. Because some of Q-Bee's pokes out range Lilith's pokes and even her fireball, this matchup is incredibly tough for Lilith. For the nail in the coffin, Q-Bee is able to anti-air Lilith very effectively, while the reverse is not true at all. The one hope Lilith has in this matchup is to neutral/defensive jump/superjump to mess with Q-Bee's IAD auto-target function, TK fireballs from a large distance, and pray for random successful LI's. Meanwhile Q-Bee can just out-poke everything all day and fish for whiffed DP attempts.
|n.LP||5||+6||+5||0/3/6||Mid||Yes/Rapid||Renda+: H:+9 B:+8|
|n.LK||6||+3||+2||0/ 3/ 6||Mid||Yes/Rapid||Renda+: H:+6 B:+5|
|LP||5||+6||+5||0/ 3/ 6||Mid||Yes/Rapid||Renda+: H:+9 B:+8|
|LK||6||+5||+4||0/ 3/ 6||Mid||Yes/Rapid||Renda+: H:+8 B:+7|
|c.LP||4||+8||+7||0/ 3/ 6||Mid||Yes/Rapid||Renda+: H:+11 B:+10|
|c.LK||4||+6||+5||0/ 3/ 6||Low||Yes||Renda+: H:+9 B:+8|
|dn.LP||4||+7||+6||0/ 3/ 6||Mid||×|
|dn.LK||5||+4||+3||0/ 3/ 6||Mid||×|
|d.LP||4||+7||+6||0/ 3/ 6||Mid||×|
|d.LK||5||+6||+5||0/ 3/ 6||Mid||×|
|j.LP||5||0/ 3/ 6||High||Yes|
|j.LK||6||0/ 3/ 6||High||Yes|
|236LP||13||+2||-8||12/16/21||Mid||Downs Airborne Opponents|
|236PP||20||+9||-1||0/ 0/ 0||Mid|
|j.236LP||12||12/16/21||Mid||Downs Airborne Opponents|
|j.236MP||12||12/16/21||Mid||Landing Suki: 1F|
|j.236PP||19||0/ 0/ 0||Mid|
|623MP||7||Down||-21||22/26/31||Mid||Landing Suki: 4F|
|623PP||5||Down||-36||0/ 0/ 0||Mid||Inv: 10F|
|214LK||4||Down||-19||18/21/24||Mid||Landing Suki: 10F|
|214KK||6||Down||-20||0/ 0/ 0||Mid|
|LP LP 6 LK HP||1||4||Down||-23||Mid||(*2)|
- 1: Landing Suki 10F
- 2: Landing Suki on block 10F, air version startup 2F, Invincible 1F.
- Dash Links with lp, RENDA st.lp LINK d.lp
- In the corner, ES-Soul Flash can be used as a frame trap for big damage
- Lilith cannot cancel her 3-frames of super-jump startup with any attack
- Dashing attacks execute as 1-frame faster
- Dark Force of "Mimic Doll" LP+LP or MP+MK has a 31-frame delay to Lilith's attacks & does 25% damage.
- Lilith's frame advantage after a throw-tech differs from mid-screen compared to the corner
- To complete a LI confirm with cr.lk, st.mk or cr.lk, st.hp; will leave Lilith with +2f or +3f, but, the distance from the opponent will change slightly. Decide accordingly, as you may want to jump or dash to continue pressurewhen you confirm the block. Additionally, on-hit, the HP x LI confirm will place Lilith closer to the opponent & avoid a slight screen scroll.
- To compare a LI confirm with d.mk or d.close-hp; the hp has 2-more frames of hitstun, making the LI confirm marginally easier.
- st.far-HP has more push-back & can cause LI to whiff from a confirm. just assume cr.lk, st.far-HP x LI will always whiff at mid-screen.
- To compare damage of d.mk x LI or d.hp x LI; The white damage is equal. The red damage is definitely in favor for the HP-versoin. Be mindfull, that consistency of confirms is more important than overall damage in one situation.
- A corner attack with LI can be 19-hits in total, as some light punches may whiff.
- Soul Flash has no minimum height restriction. This makes Tiger-Knee Soul Flash very strong. Tiger-Knee soul flash is a great Anti-Air.
- Seems Lilith cannot special cancel if she does an empty-air-chain. J.lp, j.mk-whiff, recover, j.mk... LI is still possible tho.
- Es-Shining blade has a big enough gap between the hits for the opponent to execute a Dark Force & get a HUGE punish.
- After air-guarding, it seems Morrigan & Lilith cannot immediately ground guard. This becomes troublesome with LeiLei's Tenraiha.
- Counter setups to corner-throw-tech traps, by: Hosokawa
- Alter Ego Unblockable
- The mimic doll does not cause proximity blocking
- Tech-Hit x Projectile Displacement w/ Soul Flash
- Guard-Lock Unblock w/ ES-Soul Flash
- Unblock Puppet Show on Q-Bee & Zabel State-Changing Meter-Costing Projectile
- LI Auto-correct kill forces a missing Torso
- Desync Luminous Illusion in Dark Force
- Impossible Drop-Out Combo
- Alter-Ego remains without Dark Force
- Combine the IMPOSSIBLE DROP-OUT COMBO with the DESYNC LI IN DF BUG
- High-Jump x Dark Force (HP+HK) Bug
- Do HP+HK Dark Force then super-jump as soon as you recover
- Alter Ego Reduction
- Lilith can force this bug onto herself by deactivating Dark Force while the mirage is in hit-stop
- Dark Force x Juggle State
- Unblock ES-Guard Cancel Frames
- See The first chart here - Lilith is at frames 5-7
Japanese Player Index: http://www21.atwiki.jp/vsplayer/pages/21.html
|Name (English)||Name (Japanese)||Color||Location||Contact||Notes|